| Notes |
- RESEARCH_NOTES:
1. We have results of DNA testing comparing the southern NJ Winners to Dutch Winnes which confirms the two families are not related! Some emails on the subject:
A. 7 May 2012 email from Roger Winner, a direct descendant of Pieter Winne, has who had done a DNA test. He notes: "I have spent much time researching all early Winners but in particular my Pieter Winne lines. In all of my research I have not found anything suggesting a common ancestor for the two lines. ... I am in the direct male line descending for Pieter ..."
B. 9 May 2012 email from Roger Winner to Judy Winner . He notes: "The DNA tests provided the result I was looking for. Your husband and I do not share a common ancestor and therefore your line of Winners are not descended from Pieter Winne. Ancestry and Family Tree only have 32 of the 37 markers but I did not match 12 of the 32 markers."
C. From an ancestry.com message board http://boards.ancestry.com/surnames.winne/231.1.1.2.1/mb.ashx of 2009 from a Judith Winner: "Family cemetery in Pike Co,Illinois shows John Winner (b Jan. 18, 1787, d Aug. 9, 1860). DOD may be Aug 18,1860. Family history says he was from Hamilton, Ohio. Married Hester Mason, etc. My husband Richard Winner has a 37 dNa marker match with Maurice D. (Mike) Winner, Jr., from Gloucester Co., NJ. His line is Maurice D. Sr 1904-1974, Lawrence C. - 1874-1943, James R. - 1850-1929, Joseph Winner - 1822 - 1895."
D. 19 Sep 2012 email from Judy Winner : "My husband Richard D. Winner is descended from Pike Co Illinois Winners. We have 37 marker Family Tree dNa. We heard from Maurice Dawson Winner who lives in Gloucester Co. NJ and Richard matches him.
Richard's line is:
John Winner (1787-1860)
Samuel Winner (10-13-1810 10-15-1882)
Thomas Winner (7-5-1849/after 1920)
Samuel Eaves Winner (12-24-1873 - 1918-1920?)
Warren Thomas Winner (6-25-1903/7-28-1988)
Richard D. Winner (1947 -)
I have emails from Roger rlwhershey@att.net who we shared dNa results which I will forward. [See above email from Roger dated 9 May 2012] Asked Richard's 70+ sister where her father lived (Warren) and she said on Dutch Creek. This is in Pike Co, IL where the Winner Cemetery is located. [Copy of DNA certificate and results in image file. I have emails from Roger rlwhershey@att.net who we shared dNa results which I will forward. [See above email from Roger dated 9 May 2012] Asked Richard's 70+ sister where her father lived (Warren) and she said on Dutch Creek. This is in Pike Co, IL where the Winner Cemetery is located. [Copy of DNA certificate and results in image file. Test results for Richard D. Winner by Family Tree DNA dated 9 Jul 2008. DYS #/Allele: 393/13, 390/24, 19-394/14, 391/11, 385a/11, 385b/13, 426/12, 388/12, 439/12, 389-1/13, 392/13, 389-2/29, 458/17, 459a/8, 459b/10, 455/11, 454/11, 447/24, 437/15, 448/19, 449/29, 464a/14, 464b/15, 464c/17, 464d/17, 460/10, H4/10, YCA-11a/19, YCA-11b/23, 456/15, 607/16, 576/17, 570/17, CDYa/38, CDYb/38, 442/12, 438/12]]
E. Email from Kris Winner, Jul 24, 2012. "Hi Kerry - thanks for sending your notes. It looks like you and I are on the same track to some extent. I have come to many of the same conclusions. I may have some bits that you don't - I have spent a lot of time in Trenton and in DC trolling through the archives. So, where you have notes on some of the births or deaths or marriages, I have copies of the actual documents, some of which have additional names included. I think I will go through your notes and add in red where I might have a document of interest and you can let me know if you have it or not. My line is probably through Abraham/John. You may have seen a post on the message board (see http://boards.ancestry.com/surnames.winne/231.1.1.2.1/mb.ashx from a Judy Winner. The Maurice she mentions is my dad's cousin. I met him two years or so ago in North Carolina and got some great things from him on more recent relatives, and he told me he had done the dna thing and came up with a match to the Ohio crowd. I have not emailed her about her query, but might have something for her, specifically that two of John Winner's sons were on a jury with Hester Ann Mason's brother, Case Mason, making a "link" to the Great Egg Harbor crowd. I often wondered if this John was the son of Septimus that was unaccounted for in his will according to Kim Secrist on the message boards again. I don't have Septimus's will, I need to get that to see exactly what it says."
F. 19 Sep 2012 email from me to Judy, Roger, Kris, and Karen Winner:
"Your husband's DNA tests against Maurice Winner and Roger Winner confirm my research. I have no DNA tests to add since I am not of the Winner surname, but I do have extensive historical research which anticipated and surmised what you have found. Many have suspected, but I believe I am the first to come to the firm conclusion that the southern NJ Winners come from Bucks Co., PA and not the Dutch Winne line...
Your second email today notes that Roger Winner, a confirmed descendant of Pieter Winne, has compared his DNA and it does not match your husband's, which I would have expected... Finally we have proof that the lines are not the same even though dozens of researchers have spent lifetimes on the subject. There continues to be much bad reporting connecting these two lines. We can now move beyond all that.
Your exact match to Maurice Winner is no surprise to me... Kris has not provided me an exact ancestral line; however, you mention on your board posting: "His line is Maurice D. Sr 1904-1974, Lawrence C. - 1874-1943, James R. - 1850-1929, Joseph Winner - 1822 - 1895." The 1822 Joseph is a generation or two removed from the earliest Winners I connect, but he is definitely in our mix. I believe he may be the son of Joseph Winner, b. 1803, who had a brother John and Amos. Their father is in turn John Winner who married Millicent Mapes (and also married Hannah Carr before Millicent). This John is my database and has probably 3 brothers and 1 sister (all of which you will see on my database). Their father, I believe, is our first surmised ancestor Isaac Winner (1733-1781) who married Rebecca ___, all of Bucks Co. Of John's brothers, one was Isaac (Jr) (1755 Bucks Co., PA - 1819 Monmouth Co., NJ) who married twice. He is the progenitor of the all the Southeast NJ Winners. His first wife was Hannah Searls, who had several children including your John Winner who married Hester Mason ... The fact that your husband's DNA and Maurice's match would put the common ancestor at the original Isaac Sr. of Bucks Co. - who is the earliest ancestor I have surmised thus far. Now that the linkage is more certain, it would be good for you to continue to compare with other Bucks Co. Winner descendants. Isaac Sr. had another son James who stayed in the area and has numerous descendants in Lycoming Co., Pennsylvania. I would be great to test against that major branch and proof would be outstanding icing on the cake. I have emailed Karen Winner of the James Winner line with a copy of this email (she has also reviewed my research paper) and perhaps she can locate a suitable candidate on her branch for DNA testing."
G. 19 Sep 2012 email from Roger Winner (of the Winne line). He gives me his DNA test results which were done by Ancestry.com. Location/value: 19a/14, 19b/-, 385a/11, 385b/11, 388/12, 389-I/13, 389-II/30, 390/25, 391/11, 392/13, 393/13, 426/12, 437/15, 438/12, 439/12, 441/14, 442/17, 444/12, 445/12, 446/14, 447/24, 448/19, 449/30, 452/31, 454/11, 455/11, 456/16, 458/16.2, 459a/9, 459b/10, 460/11, 461/12, 462/11, 463/25, 464a/15, 464b/15, 464c/17, 464d/17, 464e/-, 464f/-, GGAATI-B07/10, YCA-IIa/19, YCC-IIb/21, Y-GAFA-A10/15, 635/23, Y-GATA-H4.1/22. Also notes that he is of the paternal haplogroup R1b.
2. The book: "A History of Monmouth and Ocean Counties, Embracing a Genealogical Record, Etc.," by Edwin Salter, published 1890, p. lxiv: "Winner, Winnow - John Winnow's (or Winner's) house is named in a survey 1790 between North and Middle branches Forked River on main road from Goodluck to Egg Harbor. Jonathan Winer lived at same place at a little later date. Jonathan was m. to Sarah Predmore, July 28, 1800. His dau. or sister Mary m. Samuel Worden, who d. in 1812; she d. in 1828 a. 59 years. [George] King Winner of Toms River, a coasting captain, went West, probably to San Francisco, about forty years ago."
3. Currently my thinking is that John only had three sons and no daughters. The three sons from oldest to youngest are Thomas, Samuel, and William.
Thomas, according to submitters on Worldconnect, was born 7 Apr 1817 in Lebanon, Warren, OH, and d. 8 Oct 1897 in Quincy, Adams, IL. These dates are supported by Thomas's gravestone in Winner Cemetery at Hadley Twp., Pike, IL. His wife is Elizabeth Ann Burton for whom we also find a tombstone: "Eliza A. Winner, Nov. 13, 1819-Nov. 28, 1898." [See photos of their tombstones on the Web, which were contributed by Jack Winner in 2006 .] Thomas's children were born from 1840 to 1856 in Beverly, Adams, IL. Thomas being buried in Pike co. with his parents in the Winner cemetery even though he lived in Adams Co. evidences the relationship. See burial information below for more detail.
Samuel, according to his tombstone in Winner Cemetery (see above), was born 14 Oct 1810 (calculated by age at death; in New Jersey per censuses) and died "9 Mar 1882" at the age of "71y, 4m, 26d." He married Sarah Peterson, whose tombstone is also in the same cemetery, and reads: "Sarah, wife of S. Winner, died Dec. 25, 1863, Aged 52 yrs. 11 mos. 15 ds." We see Samuel in near proximity to his father John in the 1840-1860 censuses. The 1850 census shows him as age 40, b. in NJ. He may have remarried 15 Jun 1864 in Pike co. to Ellen House. He shows up in the 1830 US census in Williamsburg, Clermont, OH (males: 1<5, 1@20-29; female: 1@15-19).
William, according to submitters on Worldconnect, was born 31 Jul 1814 in Clermont co., Ohio. We see William in near proximity to his father John and brother Samuel in the 1840-1860 censuses. Most importantly he married Rachel Predmore (4 Aug 1836 Clermont Co., OH), who was the daughter of Ephraim Predmore, the brother of Sarah Predmore who married Jonathan Winner, John's brother. The Predmores originate in Waretown, Monmouth (now Ocean), New Jersey, as do this branch of the Winners. We also see Predmores in close proximity in Pike Co., IL. In fact Ephraim Predmore is buried in the same Winner Cemetery. This Predmore/Winner association is very significant since it ties John Winner to Forked River/Waretown and not to the John Winner/Millicent Mapes family of Egg Harbor to whom most have tried to traditionally link him as a son.
The marriages of these three sons are listed in Clermont Co., Ohio:
-Samuel Winner and Sara Peterson 15 Oct 1829 by D.D. Davison, MG.
-William Winner and Rachel Priedmore on 18 Jun 1835 by Wm. Hartman, JP.
-Thomas Winner and Eliza Ann Burton on 4 Aug 1836 by Alex Blair, JP.
It should be noted that many have tried to link another son Benjamin to John and Hester. This is probably because of Benjamin's residence in Pike co. after 1840 and his marriage in Clermont co. Benjamin is John's nephew (son of John's brother Jonathan). He evidently followed his cousins from Ohio to Illinois. See notes of Benjamin in this database for more discussion on this subject of who is his father, but a quick summary includes the following reasons:
-Benjamin was too old being born in 1801 to be John and Hester's son.
-Benjamin shows up in the 1830 census next to his father Jonathan in Brown Co.
-The censuses for John Winner appear to only support three sons.
-Benjamin in the Pike co., IL, censuses is not right next door to John as are his two sons William and Samuel.
-Benjamin names two of his children Jonathan and Sarah (his father's and mother's names). There is no John or Hester names among Benjamin's children.
-In the 1860 census, there are two young adults Benjamin and Joseph Conkland living with Benjamin. Benjamin's sister Amy married William B. Conklin in 1832 and these are most likely Benjamin's nephews.
-Proximity of both John and Benjamin in Clermont co. is easily explained. Benjamin's father owned land which straddled the county line of Brown (Perry Twp.) and Clermont (Wayne Twp.). Benjamin, when he is reported in Clermont co., is in Wayne Twp. John lived in Batavia Twp. in Clermont co. Benjamin, when reported in Clermont co., is actually closer to Jonathan than John.
4. Censuses:
1820 US: Batavia Twp., Clermont, OH, 7 Aug 1820, no other Winners besides John in same Twp:
John Winner: Males: 3<10, 1@16-25, 1@26-44; females: 1@26-44. [Three boys are probably Samuel 10, Thomas 7, and William 3; older boy/man is probably either help or another indirect relative.]
1830 US: Batavia Twp., Clermont, OH, p. 9, no other Winners besides John in same Twp:
John Winner: Males: 1@10-14, 1@15-19, 1@40-49; females: 1@40-49. [Two boys are probably Thomas 17 and William 13.]
1840 US: Pike Co., OH, very faded:
John Winner: 1 male 50-60; 1 female 50-60.
On same page as immediate neighbors:
-William Winner, males: 1<5, 1@20-30; females: 1@20-30.
-Samuel Winner, males: 2<5, 2@5-10, 1@20-30, 1@60-70; females: 1<5, 1@20-30.
1850 US: Twp. 4S 4W, Pike, IL, 7 Sep 1850, 355/368, several Predmore families nearby:
John Winner, 64, farmer, $100, NJ.
Hester A. Winner, 62, NJ.
On same page we find two sons of John and Hester:
353/366: William Winner, 36, farmer, OH.
Rachel, 35, OH. [This would be Rachel Predmore, dau. of Ephraim Predmore and neice of Sarah (Predmore) Winner, Jonathan's wife.]
Elizabeth, 13, OH.
Ephraim, 12, OH.
Sarah, 8, IL.
Hepsibe, 1, female, IL.
350/363: Samuel Winner, 40, farmer, $420, NJ.
Sarah, 40, NJ.
John, 20, farmer, OH.
Samuel, 17, farmer, OH.
Hester A., 14, farmer, OH.
Joshua, 12, IL.
Lovania, 8, IL.
Rebecca A., 4, IL.
Thomas, 1, IL.
1855 Illinois State, Township 4, Pike co., 3 Jul 1855, extremely faded and unreadable but there appears perhaps two or three more Winner families with younger children as immediate neighbors:
John Winner: 1 male 60-70; 1 female 60-70.
1860 US: Hadley Twp., Pike, IL, 24 Aug 1860, 1359/1359, Levina is John's granddaughter and Samuel's daughter; also several Predmore families nearby:
Joseph Mathews, 25, PA.
Levina, 17, IL.
Sarah C., 4/12, IL.
John Winner, 76, NJ. [Indexed as Wizner.]
On same page:
-1361/1361: William Winner, 46, farmer, $3000/1000, OH.
Rachel, 45, NJ.
Hepsy B., 11; John, 9; William, 7; Jesse, 4; Joseph, 2; all b. IL.
-1358/1358: Samuel Winner, 49, farmer, $1600/50, NJ.
Sarah, 49, NJ.
Becky Ann, 14, IL.
Thomas, 12, IL.
5. FHL book 977.1794 H2h "History of Clermont County, Ohio...," by Louis H. Evarts (1880, Philadelphia). Clermont County adjoins Brown County where John's brother Jonathan lived:
-p. 250: Property owners in Batavia Twp.: "John Winner, No. 2057; Nathan Darby, original proprietor.
-pp. 266-7: "The Pisgah Methodist Episcopal Church. At this point was organized, about 1816, a class which first assembled at the house of a man named Mason, and later at the house of John Winner, the former's son-in-law. Among the members are remembered the names of Daniel Parker, the Masons, the Atcheleys, Mary Kidd, and the Curlis family. Some time about 1818 a log meeting-house was built on the site of the present church, which was destroyed by an incendiary twenty years later. In the present house services have not been held with any regularity since 1854, although the right to the property has always been maintained by the denomination, and an occasional funeral service is yet here held..."
6. Email dated 22 Jun 2004 from Gary Coon concerning John Winner in Clermont co: "There are land transactions from Wm. Lytle to John Winner dated 1 Nov 1811, 6 Sep 1816, and a couple more in 1829 and 1833. There is also a transaction from Lytle & Barr to Joseph Mason (John Winner's father-in-law) or property next to John in 1817."
7. FHL film 333136 is Clermont Co.'s Deed Index 1800-1879. There are four transactions shown:
A. 1833 William Barr for himself aand John S. Lytle & E.S. Haines, executors for William Lytle, deceased, heirs to John Winner of Clermont co., G2-31, p. 421, 58 acres, part of Iskam Keith's survey 1701 and Nathaniel Darby's survey 2057, for $1 in consideration. Deed notes that Wm. Lytle sold the land 6 Sep 1816 to John Winner and this deed appears to transfer the title. Land is described in great detail and is noted as bordering on J. Mason's property. This is most likely Joseph Mason, John's father-in-law.
B. 26 Jan 1833 Harvey Ogden and his wife Eliza to John Winner, I2-33, p. 221, townlot #101, Batavia, $500, 1/8 acre
C. 4 Mar 1834 John Winner to Thomas S. Stark, both of Clermont Co., G2-31, p. 318, 73-1/8, surveys [faded] 4236? and on the waters of the Little Miami river being part of James Johnson's survey 5252 (with lengthy description), $500, wife Hester religuishes her dower rights, recorded 9 Jun 1834. Jonathan signs with signature and Hester by mark. Note next deed is Harvey Ogden to same buyer. Next deed after that is Thomas Stack to John Brown.
D. 12 Apr 1836 John and Hester Winner to Calvin A. Warren, K2-34, p. 450, townlot #1010, Batavia, land previous bought from Harvey Ogden and his wife, $800, 1/8 acre, John signs with signature and Hester signs with a mark, recorded 27 Apr 1836.
8. The following is my extraction of any Winner marriages found in the FHL book 977.3453 V2k "The Marriage Records of Pike County, IL," by, Mrs. Agnes DuVal Keller, 1980, extracted from 1827 to 1859. I include this for informational purposes for other researcher since these are probably grandchildren of John and Hester Ann (Mason) Winner or children of Benjamin and Mary (Brown) Winner:
-William T. Sitton - Hannah Winner, 26 Jun 1842.
-Jonathan Winner - Rebecca Peckham, 23 Jan 1851.
-James Barns - Hester Ann Winner, 18 Sep 1851.
-James Kilgore - Elizabeth Winner, 7 Nov 1852.
-James Winner - Isabella Lambert, 18 Aug 1853.
-Ephraim Winner - Sophia Burgett, 7 Jun 1857.
-Albert G. Burgett - Sarah Ann Winner, 11 Mar 1858.
-James Winner - Susan Lad, 23 Sep 1858.
-Joseph Matthews - Lovina Winner, 12 Apr 1859.
9. Two bad connections have been copied and passed on through miscellaneous LDS Archive family group sheets, LDS Ancestral File, and submitter-based Internet bases. Apparently no one has taken time to really check them, and so new research shows these need to be corrected. One shows Benjamin Winner born in New Jersey about 1801 to John Winner and Hester Ann Mason and a death after 1860. We know this link to be erroneous since Benjamin was the son of John's brother Jonathan (birth and death dates are okay). See separate note above for reasons for this correction. The other bad connection is to link John who married Hester as a son to John and Millicent (Mapes) Winner of Egg Harbor City area of Gloucester Co. (now Atlantic Co.) This should also be corrected to show John as the son of Isaac Winner of Dover Twp., Monmouth, and brother to Jonathan Winner. See below for more on this.
The following is a copy of email dated 4 Jul 2004 from Gary Coon which provides detail on the Winners of Egg Harbor, NJ. I concur that John Winner (wife Hester) is not a son of John (wife Millicent). I believe, however, that John Winner was the son of Isaac Winner of Dover Township:
"I've looked back and rechecked some notes about the Winners of Great Egg Harbor. I am convinced that John Winner (wife Hester Mason) is NOT the son of John Winner and Melscent Mapes of Great Egg Harbor.
Will of Joseph Mapes: 25 Jan 1787. Leaves property to wife Mary, dau. Melicent Winner, and grandson Joseph Winner. Exec. wife Mary and son-in-law John Winner.
Will of Melscent Winner: 18 Apr 1791, to son Amos, all lands bequeathed by father. Use of it by husband John Winner. Codicel 1 Dec 1793: Should son Amos die before age of majority without issue, said lands to son John Winner. Will proved 12 Aug 1806.
To me this means that son Joseph born before 1787, son Amos before 1791, and son John between 1791 and 1793. I figure that Joseph got his inheritance directly from grandpa so Melicent was giving hers to Amos. But then John arrived and she had to think of him too. Strange that she wouldn't divide it between Amos and John.
John Winner married Abigail Doughty 9 May 1812 in Gloucester Co., NJ. (John Jr., I believe.)
Land transactions continue after this point for all John Sr. and his sons distinguishing between John Sr. and John Jr. They continue for John Jr. up till 1820.
Will of John Winner, Jr.: inventoried 1 Nov 1823 in Egg Harbor. (I haven't seen the estate document.)
Abby Winner [wife of John Jr.] shows up in the 1830 census with no husband. I believe she remarries a Mr. Veneble sometime after.
So it seems clear that John Winner (born 1786) of Clermont Co., OH, is not the son of John Winner of Great Egg Harbor. This John was married to Hester Ann Mason. Her father Joseph was living in that area of Gloucester Co. One of his sons, Case, stayed there and died in the county. So John did have ties to Gloucester Co.
Now John Winner Sr. of Great Egg Harbor did have ties to the Winner boys of neighboring Burlington Co. Going over the tax records, land records, wills, and marriages of this group, there could be seven brothers: Abraham, Jesse, Thomas, William, John, Samuel, Septimus. (It is said that traditionally a Septimus is the seventh son.) These guys show up together on wills, land deals, and such. Ex: Septimus and William owed his father-in-law's estate for three years rent. Jesse and John are mentioned elsewhere as owning money together. I believe John married Hannah Carr on 1 Apr 1776. she died in childbirth in 1778. He married Melicent Mapes (widow of John Coates) afterward settled in Great Egg Harbor with her family (if not already living there).
So John [Winner of Clermont Co., OH] could have been the son of one of them. I've ruled out John, Septimus (he moved to Butler Co., OH, but his son John is said to be the one ending up in Logan co., OH), William died 1813 (and the adm'r was Jesse Winner; no family mentioned), and Thomas was a resident of Philadelphia at the time of his marriage in 1780 (though he had property in Burlington and his wife was living there at the time of the marriage). John [of Clermont Co., OH] was born in 1786 in NJ but both parents were listed from PHIL on a 1798 land sale in Burlington. Most likely his father was Abraham, Jesse, or Samuel.
Other Winner males about his age, said to be related to Abraham are: Isaac Sr. m. Hannah Searle 9 Nov 1776 in NJ (both from Bucks Co., PA) and Jacob m. Elizabeth Helling 29 Sep 1774 in NJ (both from Bucks Co., PA).
Other unaccounted Winner males include:
Amos m. Rebeca Cooper 1 May 1779.
Isaac of Dover, Monmouth Co.
Still don't know where Jonathan and Isaac come in, but because they moved to Ohio with John and Hester, her father Joseph Mason, and also Benjamin moving on to IL with John and Hester, they have to have close family ties to this Burlington bunch.
One last thing. Jonathan and Benjamin's neighbor in 1830 was Benjamin Doughty from Burlington. John and Joseph Winner were co-bondsmen on the estate of Yelverton Doughty. The adm'r was Thomas Doughty, possible brother of Benjamin Doughty and father of Abigail Doughty.
I'm not too sure about the Lycoming Co. [PA] Winners fitting in here very closely. They seem to be more removed from this group. My gggrandmother (Isabell Lambert m. James L. Winner) said the Winners had lived in Bucks Co., PA. It appears that the Bucks Co. Winners had NJ interests, most likely in Burlington Co., just across the river. (Ex: Isaac Sr. and Amos marriages above.)"
10. I include an unverifed list of grand-Children of John's three sons from user submitted Internet material. I have not reviewed the accuracy of the lists, but thought it potentially helpful in following the descendants of John's grandchildren. Some call the son Samuel as Samuel George Winner, but I am not sure why. Supposed grand-Children:
A. Samuel and wife Sarah Peterson:
i. John Leopold Winner was born 21 Aug 1830 in OH.
ii Samuel George Winner was born 13 Jan 1834 in Hamilton, Butler, OH, died 31 Mar 1919 in Prentice, IL.
iii. Hester Ann Winner was born 15 Jun 1836 in Clermont Co. OH., and died 1903.
iv. Joshua Milan Winner was born 16 Apr 1838 in New Salem, Pike. Ill., and died 30 Sep 1919 in lola, KS..
v. Amy Catherine Winner was born 8 Feb 184l in Pike Co. Illinois.
vi. Levonia Winnerwas born 1842.
vii. Rebecca Ann Winner was born 1846 in Pike Co. Illinois.
viii. Thomas Winner was born 5 Jul 1849 in Barry, Pike, Illinois.
ix. Benjamin P. Winner was born 5 Mar 1854 in Salem, Pike, Ill.
x. Jesse P. Winner was born 27 Jan 1856 in Hadley Township, Pike, Ill.
B. Samuel and second wife Ellen Hiles:
i. Benjamin L. Winner, b. 1868, Ill.
ii. Anna C. Winner, b. 1870, Ill.
C. William and wife Rachel Predmore:
i. Elizabeth, 1837 OH., ii. Ephriam 1838 OH, iii. Sarah Ann 1842 IL, iv. Hepsibe 1849 IL, v. John 1851 IL, vi. William 1853 IL, vii. Jesse 1856 IL; vii. Joseph 1858 IL.
D. Thomas and wife Eliza Ann Burton:
i. Hester Ann 1838 OH, ii. James 1840 IL, iii. Mary Ann 1842 IL, iv. Charles Henry 1845 IL, v. Catherine 1847 IL, vi. Frances 1849 IL, vii. Marietta 1851 IL, viii. Carina 1852 IL.
11. Email from Kris Winner, Jul 24, 2012. "Hi Kerry - thanks for sending your notes. It looks like you and I are on the same track to some extent. I have come to many of the same conclusions. I may have some bits that you don't - I have spent a lot of time in Trenton and in DC trolling through the archives. So, where you have notes on some of the births or deaths or marriages, I have copies of the actual documents, some of which have additional names included. I think I will go through your notes and add in red where I might have a document of interest and you can let me know if you have it or not ... My line is probably through Abraham/John...
[In commenting on John Winner who married Hester Mason] ... two of John Winner's sons were on a jury with Hester Ann Mason's brother, Case Mason, making a "link" to the Great Egg Harbor crowd..."
12. Email dated 27 May 2017 from Mike Meisinger of Overland Park, KS < mrm1970@aol.com>:
"I saw your recent post on John Winner of Pike county, Illinois. John Winner was my 4th Great Grandfather. I am descended from his son, William. I do have a few other items that may be of interest to you:
A. John Winner was in Ohio by 1813. He was part of Captain Daniel Hosbrook's Company in the War of 1812 and served February through August 1813. https://archive.org/stream/rosterofohiosold00ohio#page/n44/mode/1up <https://archive.org/stream/rosterofohiosold00ohio>
B. It was for this service that he received his land in Pike county, Illinois. https://glorecords.blm.gov/details/patent/default.aspx?accession=0601-305&docClass=MW&sid=ytowcvvn.idn#patentDetailsTabIndex=1 <https://glorecords.blm.gov/details/patent/default.aspx?accession=0601-305&docClass=MW&sid=ytowcvvn.idn>
C. The Winner Cemetery you mention in your post is actually on the Pike County / Adams County line, and the land the Winners owned in both counties was all very close together.
D. Ephraim Predmore who you mentioned and who is buried in the Winner Cemetery in Pike County was married to Mary Ann Brown. They were married in Freehold, Monmouth, New Jersey, USA. Mary lived until 1863 and is buried in the Kramer Cemetery in Brown County, OH. Also in this cemetery are several other Predmores including Mary Ann and Ephraim's sons, Richard and Benjamin, and a William Predmore, born in 1797, (possibly a brother of Ephraim??). There is a David Brown born in 1756 who could possibly be Mary Ann's father, and a Hannah Brown Curless.â€
BURIAL:
1. Online at genealogytrails.com/ill/pike/cemetery.html accessed 15 Nov 2011: Burial List for Winner Cemetery, Hadley Twp., Pike Co., IL. See website for full listing of 73 names including surnames Barnes, Burton, Chapman, Cole, Curlis, Deeder, Farmer, Hasket, Hitch, Jasper, McCartney, McClain, McCleery, Mellon, Merrick, Orr, Predmore, Shaw?, Starks, Winner, Tournear, and Woodward. Those of interest to me are:
Winners (there are many but these are the only ones of the first two generations):
-John Winner, 18 Jan 1787, 18 Aug 1860, spouse Hester.
-Hester Winner, 8 Aug 1788, 30 Mar 1860, spouse John Winner, d. of typhoid.
-Thomas Winner, 7 Apr 1817, 8 Oct 1897, spouse Eliza A.
-Eliza A. Winner, 13 Nov 1819, 28 Nov 1898, spouse Thomas Winner.
-Samuel Winner, 11 Oct 1810, 9 Mar 1882, wife Sarah.
-Sarah Winner, 10 Jan 1811, 25 Dec 1863, spouse Samuel Winner.
Predmores (there are several but these are the only ones of what looks like the first two generations):
-Ephraim Predmore, 18 Jan 1786, 12 Jan 1859.
-Joseph Predmore, 1823, 20 Nov 1898.
-Sarah Predmore, 10 Apr 1829, 8 Oct 1915.
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Chris & Julie Petersen's Genealogy
1787 - 1860 (73 years)