| Notes |
- RESEARCH_NOTES:
1. Censuses:
1787 Danish Census for Dover, Ydby, Thisted, Denmark:
Morten Jensen, 50, husband.
Karen Jacobsdatter, 52, his wife.
Johanne Mortensdatter, 5, child of this marriage.
(For some unknown reason sons Lars and Jens are not listed. From FHL film 53030, Ydby Parish, we find the christenings of Lars and Jens 19 Feb 1775 and 8 Oct 1780 respectively both to a father named Morten Jensen with no mother named. No christening for Johanne was found. There is only one Morten Jensen showing in the parish records.
1801 Danish Census for Dover, Ydby, Thisted, Denmark:
Karen Jacobsdatter, 60.
Lars Mortensen, 28, her son, soldier.
Jens Mortensen, 18, her son.
2. In my possession is an archival family group sheet dated from about the mid-1950s submitted by Frederik Christensen, Rt. 1, Burley, Idaho who identifies himself as "Gen. Soc. - Emp." He gives as his sources: "F. Den. Thisted B. 2 pt. 1; F. Den 43 part 43." According to experts at the FHL in Salt Lake City, these sources are of the old numbering system for FHL films and they would have to do research to know the exact modern equivalent. The family reads as:
Father: Lars Madsen, b. abt. 1710 at Ydby, d. 21 Feb 1773 at Ydby.
Mother: Maren Jensen, b. abt 1725 at Ydby, d. 1787.
Children all with surname of Larsen and christening dates at Ydby:
1. Kirstine Marie, 23 Aug 1750, d. 4 Jul 1756.
2. Anders, 25 Jun 1752
3. Mads, 1 Apr 1754, d. 18 Jul 1756.
4. Anne, 22 Oct 1755
5. Kirstine Marie, 19 Mar 1758, m. Anders Mikkelsen 1783.
6. Mads, 30 Apr 1761
7. Jens, 18 Nov 1764
8. Maren, 12 Jul 1767
9. Johannes, 17 Dec 1769
10. Anna Christine, 8 Apr 1773
The submitter includes a statement on the back of the sheet which reads:
"Note: The accuracy of this compilation is based upon the probate of Maren Jensen, above wife, also died in 1787, wherein she mentions her living Children. The above husband, whose wife was Maren Jensen, died 21 Feb. 1773 and is definitely not the same Lars Madsen (Matzen) who married Karen Jacobsen, 16 July 1760, nor the one whose wife died 6 Feb. 1760, nor the one whose wife died 6 Feb. 1760. The Lars Matzen who married in 1760 to Karen Jacobsen was still living in 1787 (see 1787 census). This Karen Jacobsen was likewise the first wife wife of Lars Matzen and definitely not the one who married Morten Jensen 2 Nov. 1773 as also established by the 1787 census, wherein she appears with her husband Morten Jensen."
The more traditional view of these children takes the opposing view from what this submitter does using what I have in this database (and also in Family Tree as of 12 Oct 2013) with Karen Jacobsdatter having two sequential husbands: Lars Madsen (Matzen) and Morten Jensen (alias Hauerballe); also Lars Matzen had two sequential wives: Maren Jensdatter who died in 1760 with whom Lars had the first five children of the list above and this Karen Jensdatter with whom he had the last five children of the above. My notes on researching the submitter's position and support for my opposing position, I found the following:
1. I reviewed each of the 10 children's christening records. There are some minor errors that the submitter made with the following children which makes one question the submitter's detailing:
A. Minor name errors: child 1's name in actual record is "Kierstine Marie" and child 6's is "Madz."
B. Completely wrong christening date for child #10 which should be1 Apr 1773 per the actual record.
2. I can find no evidence of any Lars Madsen/Matzen in the 1787 census for anywhere in Thisted county as purported by the submitter.
3. All 10 christening records list only the father Lars Matzen and no mother, which does not help in differentiating mothers.
4. In the last five children's christening records, I found witnesses that were specifically family members of Karen Jacobsdatter which would support my position:
Child #6: Appelone, Michel, and Dorethe Jacobsen
Child #7: Appelone and Dorethe Pedersdatter
Child #8: Michel Jacobsen
Child #9: Dorthe Jacobsen
Child #10: Michel Smed
Note of the first five children, two of them also have witnessed of interest with "Karen Jacobsdatter" for child #3 and Michel Jacobsen for child #5. This would seem to indicate some kind of close friendship between Lars Matzen of the first family and Karen Pedersdatter herself and her family.
A review of the supposed probate for Maren Jensdatter for 1787 has not been searched for and should be reviewed. Based on the above and the vital data on the parents, the most probable case is as I suggest and not that of the submitter of the archival family group sheet.
CHRISTENING:
1. FHL film # 053030; Ydby Parish Record, 1733-1809, book 2, p.148. Gives name of Karen as child of Jacob Smed and Apellones. No birth date mentioned.
MARRIAGE:
1. FHL film # 053030; Ydby Parish Record, 1733-1809, book 2, p. 121. Names Lars Matzen and Karen Jacobsdatter of Ydby. Betrothed 6 Jun 1760 and married 16 Jul 1760.
2. FHL film # 053030; Ydby Parish Record, 1733-1809, book 2, p. 121. Names Morten Jensen Hauerballe of Faberg parish and widow Karen Jacobsdatter of Ydby.
BURIAL:
1. FHL film # 053030; Ydby Parish Record, 1733-1809, book 2, p. 311: 5 Aug 1806, burial of Karen Jacobsdttr of (Lusbjorg/Lodbjerg?), age 73.
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Chris & Julie Petersen's Genealogy
1734 - 1806 (~ 71 years)